EX-eier: Ken Bates

[Sydhagen]

Klart det er mye som kan skje fremover som vi ikke har kontroll over nå, men tror ikke at Leeds hadde gått igang med å bygge VIP bokser osv viss man ikke hadde økonomi til det.

Og en annen ting. Har han egentlig startet byggingen på noe hotell ennå?

Legger til at dette bare er noe jeg tror. Har ikke noe mer kunnskap rundt dette.

[h.b]

Klart det er mye som kan skje fremover som vi ikke har kontroll over nå, men tror ikke at Leeds hadde gått igang med å bygge VIP bokser osv viss man ikke hadde økonomi til det.

Og en annen ting. Har han egentlig startet byggingen på noe hotell ennå?

Legger til at dette bare er noe jeg tror. Har ikke noe mer kunnskap rundt dette.

Vel. Han kjøpte jo Leeds uten å ha råd til å drifte den

[bwirum]

Klart det er mye som kan skje fremover som vi ikke har kontroll over nå, men tror ikke at Leeds hadde gått igang med å bygge VIP bokser osv viss man ikke hadde økonomi til det.

Og en annen ting. Har han egentlig startet byggingen på noe hotell ennå?

Legger til at dette bare er noe jeg tror. Har ikke noe mer kunnskap rundt dette.

Vel. Han kjøpte jo Leeds uten å ha råd til å drifte den

Tja, Leeds driftes jo. Om den driftes godt er et annet spørsmål, men at det driftes er hevet over enhver tvil.

[Leedsfan]

Klart det er mye som kan skje fremover som vi ikke har kontroll over nå, men tror ikke at Leeds hadde gått igang med å bygge VIP bokser osv viss man ikke hadde økonomi til det.

Og en annen ting. Har han egentlig startet byggingen på noe hotell ennå?

Legger til at dette bare er noe jeg tror. Har ikke noe mer kunnskap rundt dette.

Vel. Han kjøpte jo Leeds uten å ha råd til å drifte den

Synes du har sagt lenge at vi går med overskudd??

[Peter7]

His jeg har forstått Mendy affæren riktig, så ville altså Grayson ha denne spilleren, for så og sende ham ut på lån?!?! Stemmer dette så støtter jeg faktisk MUN fullt ut, totalt meningsløst for en 28 åring! Hadde det enda vært en 17 åring kunne jeg skjønt logikken.

Etter det jeg så av Mendy i Sandefjord kan jeg ikke forstå at han styrker laget i det hele tatt, bedre å bruke penger på noen som er bedre enn de vi allerede har - men da må dette selvsagt gjøres og ikke bare prates om...

[lojosang]

Then there’s the players we’ve failed to sign. Despite publicly stating he wanted to come to Elland Road and Simon Grayson admitting he was interested, Michael Johnson ended up at Leicester City. We apparently can’t afford to pay a third of Alan Smith’s wages, were snubbed by Keith Andrews and Lee Bowyer who favoured a move to the mighty Ipswich Town, Jonathan Woodgate decided a relegation battle with Stoke City was preferable to rejoining The Whites and we still haven’t agreed a fee for Nick Montgomery despite reports of Sheffield United desperately wanting to get his wages off their books. The list goes on and on.

Ah! Klassikeren list alle løse rykter man har hørt, og når den lista blir for kort legger man bare til "osv." eller "The list goes on and on".
Lee Bowyer dro til Ipswich fordi kona ikke ville flytte fra London.
Leicester har en milliardær som eier og går med gigantisk underskudd. Vi SKAL ikke konkurrere med dem på lønninger.
Woodgate ble vurdert som for usikker og skadeutsatt. Og å konkurrere med PL-lag på lønn og prestisje er ikke trivielt uansett.
Da står vi igjen med en like skadeskutt Smith som ville tjene 6 ganger mer enn nest best betalte, (en tredjedel av dette fra Leeds) muligens for å ligge det meste av sesongen på fysioterapautens benk, og Montgomery.

Skal vi si det da er halvannen spiker igjen i suppa hans?

[Sleivind]

http://www.thescratchingshed.com/2011/08/bates-blocks-simon-graysons-plans-to-sign-mendy/?

Da virker det faktisk som om Bates blokkerer transfers for Grayson....
Er vel bare et tidsspørsmål før noe skjer i kulissene

Så var det ikke noe hold i dette likevel.

http://www.leedsunited.com/news/20110811/trialists-continue-to-come-under-scrutiny_2247585_2417081

[Jon R]

Henstiller forumsdeltakerne om å ta en grundig sjekk på verdens børsoversikter. Verden og spesiellt europa er inne i den mest turbulente tid siden 2 verdenskrig. Tror noen her inne at dette ikke berører vår kjære ''lekegrind'' engelsk fotball Flere europeiske land er helt på randen av konkurs (england innbefattet) og dette løses ikke over natten. De fleste investorer er sannsynligvis pr dato mer opptatt av og redusere tap enn å investere i fotballklubber. Likeså gjelder de eksisterende eierne av klubbene. Det viktigste for de er å sikre klubbenes eksistens (hvertfall klubber som ikke tilhører topp 4 i sine respektive toppdivisjoner i europa).
Det blir feil at vi supportere av engelsk fotball skal dulle oss inn i en boble av en verden hvor vi tror at det kan kjøpes kreti og pleti. Get real folkens og støtt laget ut fra situasjonen resten av verden er inne i. Jeg er personlig enda preget av siste års hendelser i vårt kjære Leeds United. Hverken vil eller kan glemme sommeren jeg ikke en gang kunne garantere mine tre Leeds United Supportere (barn) at vi en gang hadde rett til å starte forestående seriepremiære. Det var tøffe tider det.

Nå kjøres klubben med streng ledelse og drives med pluss i regnskapene, kjedelig , men veldig beroligende. La det bli med det og så får vi heller være underdogs noen mnd/år inntil vi igjen kan skimte glansdager både hva verdensøkonomi og satsing innebærer.

Inntil videre henstilles alle Leedsvenner om og støtte laget i gode og onde tider MOT!!

Jeg er villig til å godta en forklaringsmodell som dette. MEN DET FORUTSETTER AT BATES &CO SIER NETTOPP DET og ikke later som om vi er satsende klubb med store ambisjoner! Det er det store misforholdet mellom de utrykte ambisjonenen og hva som (ikke) skjer i praksis som skaper en enorm frustrasjon hos meg. Hvis ikke Bates og Grayson tar innover seg at at supportere flest er utstyrt  med både kort -og langtidsminne, vil misnøyen bare spre om seg. Jeg støtter laget men liker ikke å føle meg lurt!

[newsome]

Then there’s the players we’ve failed to sign. Despite publicly stating he wanted to come to Elland Road and Simon Grayson admitting he was interested, Michael Johnson ended up at Leicester City. We apparently can’t afford to pay a third of Alan Smith’s wages, were snubbed by Keith Andrews and Lee Bowyer who favoured a move to the mighty Ipswich Town, Jonathan Woodgate decided a relegation battle with Stoke City was preferable to rejoining The Whites and we still haven’t agreed a fee for Nick Montgomery despite reports of Sheffield United desperately wanting to get his wages off their books. The list goes on and on.

Noe av det beste du har prestert på lenge!

Ah! Klassikeren list alle løse rykter man har hørt, og når den lista blir for kort legger man bare til "osv." eller "The list goes on and on".
Lee Bowyer dro til Ipswich fordi kona ikke ville flytte fra London.
Leicester har en milliardær som eier og går med gigantisk underskudd. Vi SKAL ikke konkurrere med dem på lønninger.
Woodgate ble vurdert som for usikker og skadeutsatt. Og å konkurrere med PL-lag på lønn og prestisje er ikke trivielt uansett.
Da står vi igjen med en like skadeskutt Smith som ville tjene 6 ganger mer enn nest best betalte, (en tredjedel av dette fra Leeds) muligens for å ligge det meste av sesongen på fysioterapautens benk, og Montgomery.

Skal vi si det da er halvannen spiker igjen i suppa hans?

[Tom S]

Henstiller forumsdeltakerne om å ta en grundig sjekk på verdens børsoversikter. Verden og spesiellt europa er inne i den mest turbulente tid siden 2 verdenskrig. Tror noen her inne at dette ikke berører vår kjære ''lekegrind'' engelsk fotball Flere europeiske land er helt på randen av konkurs (england innbefattet) og dette løses ikke over natten. De fleste investorer er sannsynligvis pr dato mer opptatt av og redusere tap enn å investere i fotballklubber. Likeså gjelder de eksisterende eierne av klubbene. Det viktigste for de er å sikre klubbenes eksistens (hvertfall klubber som ikke tilhører topp 4 i sine respektive toppdivisjoner i europa).
Det blir feil at vi supportere av engelsk fotball skal dulle oss inn i en boble av en verden hvor vi tror at det kan kjøpes kreti og pleti. Get real folkens og støtt laget ut fra situasjonen resten av verden er inne i. Jeg er personlig enda preget av siste års hendelser i vårt kjære Leeds United. Hverken vil eller kan glemme sommeren jeg ikke en gang kunne garantere mine tre Leeds United Supportere (barn) at vi en gang hadde rett til å starte forestående seriepremiære. Det var tøffe tider det.

Nå kjøres klubben med streng ledelse og drives med pluss i regnskapene, kjedelig , men veldig beroligende. La det bli med det og så får vi heller være underdogs noen mnd/år inntil vi igjen kan skimte glansdager både hva verdensøkonomi og satsing innebærer.

Inntil videre henstilles alle Leedsvenner om og støtte laget i gode og onde tider MOT!!

Jeg er villig til å godta en forklaringsmodell som dette. MEN DET FORUTSETTER AT BATES &CO SIER NETTOPP DET og ikke later som om vi er satsende klubb med store ambisjoner! Det er det store misforholdet mellom de utrykte ambisjonenen og hva som (ikke) skjer i praksis som skaper en enorm frustrasjon hos meg. Hvis ikke Bates og Grayson tar innover seg at at supportere flest er utstyrt  med både kort -og langtidsminne, vil misnøyen bare spre om seg. Jeg støtter laget men liker ikke å føle meg lurt!

Veldig enig, Jon!

[Cherry]

Ken er jo så forb... tøff i trynet, og slenger om seg med edder & galle når noe kommenter eller
faktisk vil vite om f eks eireforhold & lønn /forhandlinger...!!
For en supporter er det jo dette som er mest frustrerende , at man faktisk ikke vet hva som skjer i kullissene - ikke fordi vi skal vite alt først , men kanskje få litt info 
OM det er penger til spillere, eller HVORFOR targets forblir nettopp det- eller forsvinner
til middelhavsfarere rundt oss.

Det har nå vært snakk om 2-3 nye spillere i ukesvis, hvis vi tar bort Brown da - så er det etter
mine bergeninger - og uttrykte uttalelser fra Grayson minst 2-to spillere som mangler!

Regner jeg feil??

[Joe Jordan]

Hvorfor ikke bare si at klubben sliter med å få spillere på grunn av lønnskrav? Grayson og geitebukken gnåler om store ambisjoner, opprykk osv. Da legger de lista der. Og så fører de fansen bak lyset.

Jeg er 100% overbevist om at vi ikke rykker opp i år heller, men det stopper meg ikke fra å heie frem i laget i tykt og (mest) tynt.

[Per Arne]

Ken er jo så forb... tøff i trynet, og slenger om seg med edder & galle når noe kommenter eller
faktisk vil vite om f eks eireforhold & lønn /forhandlinger...!!
For en supporter er det jo dette som er mest frustrerende , at man faktisk ikke vet hva som skjer i kullissene - ikke fordi vi skal vite alt først , men kanskje få litt info 
OM det er penger til spillere, eller HVORFOR targets forblir nettopp det- eller forsvinner
til middelhavsfarere rundt oss.

Det har nå vært snakk om 2-3 nye spillere i ukesvis, hvis vi tar bort Brown da - så er det etter
mine bergeninger - og uttrykte uttalelser fra Grayson minst 2-to spillere som mangler!

Regner jeg feil??

Lonergan og O'Dea?

[HåvardK]

Henstiller forumsdeltakerne om å ta en grundig sjekk på verdens børsoversikter. Verden og spesiellt europa er inne i den mest turbulente tid siden 2 verdenskrig. Tror noen her inne at dette ikke berører vår kjære ''lekegrind'' engelsk fotball Flere europeiske land er helt på randen av konkurs (england innbefattet) og dette løses ikke over natten. De fleste investorer er sannsynligvis pr dato mer opptatt av og redusere tap enn å investere i fotballklubber. Likeså gjelder de eksisterende eierne av klubbene. Det viktigste for de er å sikre klubbenes eksistens (hvertfall klubber som ikke tilhører topp 4 i sine respektive toppdivisjoner i europa).
Det blir feil at vi supportere av engelsk fotball skal dulle oss inn i en boble av en verden hvor vi tror at det kan kjøpes kreti og pleti. Get real folkens og støtt laget ut fra situasjonen resten av verden er inne i. Jeg er personlig enda preget av siste års hendelser i vårt kjære Leeds United. Hverken vil eller kan glemme sommeren jeg ikke en gang kunne garantere mine tre Leeds United Supportere (barn) at vi en gang hadde rett til å starte forestående seriepremiære. Det var tøffe tider det.

Nå kjøres klubben med streng ledelse og drives med pluss i regnskapene, kjedelig , men veldig beroligende. La det bli med det og så får vi heller være underdogs noen mnd/år inntil vi igjen kan skimte glansdager både hva verdensøkonomi og satsing innebærer.

Inntil videre henstilles alle Leedsvenner om og støtte laget i gode og onde tider MOT!!

Jeg er villig til å godta en forklaringsmodell som dette. MEN DET FORUTSETTER AT BATES &CO SIER NETTOPP DET og ikke later som om vi er satsende klubb med store ambisjoner! Det er det store misforholdet mellom de utrykte ambisjonenen og hva som (ikke) skjer i praksis som skaper en enorm frustrasjon hos meg. Hvis ikke Bates og Grayson tar innover seg at at supportere flest er utstyrt  med både kort -og langtidsminne, vil misnøyen bare spre om seg. Jeg støtter laget men liker ikke å føle meg lurt!

Jeg er veldig enig. Imidlertid ville jo slike uttalelser rime dårlig med den stadige økningen av billettpriser som supporterne opplever. Mulig Bates tror at vi er så lettlurte at vi glemmer "ambisjonene"? Og til en viss grad har han jo rett i det - hvis det skulle stemme. De (vi) kommer jo tilbake, uansett hva det koster.

[lojosang]

Henstiller forumsdeltakerne om å ta en grundig sjekk på verdens børsoversikter. Verden og spesiellt europa er inne i den mest turbulente tid siden 2 verdenskrig. Tror noen her inne at dette ikke berører vår kjære ''lekegrind'' engelsk fotball Flere europeiske land er helt på randen av konkurs (england innbefattet) og dette løses ikke over natten. De fleste investorer er sannsynligvis pr dato mer opptatt av og redusere tap enn å investere i fotballklubber. Likeså gjelder de eksisterende eierne av klubbene. Det viktigste for de er å sikre klubbenes eksistens (hvertfall klubber som ikke tilhører topp 4 i sine respektive toppdivisjoner i europa).
Det blir feil at vi supportere av engelsk fotball skal dulle oss inn i en boble av en verden hvor vi tror at det kan kjøpes kreti og pleti. Get real folkens og støtt laget ut fra situasjonen resten av verden er inne i. Jeg er personlig enda preget av siste års hendelser i vårt kjære Leeds United. Hverken vil eller kan glemme sommeren jeg ikke en gang kunne garantere mine tre Leeds United Supportere (barn) at vi en gang hadde rett til å starte forestående seriepremiære. Det var tøffe tider det.

Nå kjøres klubben med streng ledelse og drives med pluss i regnskapene, kjedelig , men veldig beroligende. La det bli med det og så får vi heller være underdogs noen mnd/år inntil vi igjen kan skimte glansdager både hva verdensøkonomi og satsing innebærer.

Inntil videre henstilles alle Leedsvenner om og støtte laget i gode og onde tider MOT!!

Jeg er villig til å godta en forklaringsmodell som dette. MEN DET FORUTSETTER AT BATES &CO SIER NETTOPP DET og ikke later som om vi er satsende klubb med store ambisjoner! Det er det store misforholdet mellom de utrykte ambisjonenen og hva som (ikke) skjer i praksis som skaper en enorm frustrasjon hos meg. Hvis ikke Bates og Grayson tar innover seg at at supportere flest er utstyrt  med både kort -og langtidsminne, vil misnøyen bare spre om seg. Jeg støtter laget men liker ikke å føle meg lurt!

Frustrasjonen er vel mindre enorm her, men jeg er helt enig.

[DenHviteYeboah]

Synes dette innlegget var meget bra, men får vel grisekjeft for å formidle det på dette forum..jeg registrerer at på andre Leedsforum så er det blitt en ganske så stor negativ front imot klubbeieren....

In light of the desolate performances of last week, and the size of the immediate squad, I'm astonished at the lack of response by the board. Not one person can truly believe this set of players can lift us from this division. The question now has to be asked; is this the goal? Based on the evidence it's a resounding NO. Even if Bates has lost his mind he still has ex players and experienced board members in advisory roles. Are these people in fear of losing there jobs if they do challenge? Or do they actually buy in to Bates' idea of commercialising the Leeds United brand with bottom of the barrel sales and propaganda agendas (see official website)? Either way business has trumped football yet again and we are here to pick up the pieces, both financially and emotionally. At the moment Leeds United football club do not exist for me, only a lesser, diluted version created by Ken Bates. They are shamelessly touting our loyalty to achieve their own ends and if we want our club to remain the fantastically supported force it is we better just get on and accept it. In a moment of sheer lunacy I did buy a season ticket, but Ken Bates will never get another penny out of me and I'd urge others to act the same.

[Masinga]

Kritikken av hvordan klubben drives slår flere veier og det er litt viktig at man skiller mellom snørr og barter.

Det er lenge siden jeg uttrykte at jeg føler Bates holder oss litt på gress. Det var mens vi var i League One. Som kjent møtte den trofaste tilhengerskaren opp i et antall av 25. - 26.000 på alle hjemmekampene også i den divisjonen. Til tross for mye prat, lurte jeg og lurer fortsatt på hvilke ambisjoner Bates har med klubben. Eller synes han det er greit å være på et lavere nivå så lenge klubben går i pluss?

Da er vi med en gang over i neste tema. Økonomi. Vi er vant til at fotballklubber skal drives uansvarlig. Ikke bare Leeds, men omtrent alle klubber vi kan tenke oss. Tankegangen er at en klubb ikke skal gå med overskudd. Tvert i mot, den skal drives uansvarlig, men ikke så uansvarlig at det bærer i administrasjon. En klubbeier skal aldri forlate en klubb før pengekista er tom! Slik tenker vi, om ikke høyt så litt i det stille. Her har jeg faktisk litt sansen for Bates, som nekter å være med på et tapsprosjekt. Problemet er alle klubbene som ikke har tatt innover seg at en fotballklubb bør følge vanlige regler for å drive en bedrift.

En tredje ting er lederstil. Ken Bates kunne aldri ha oppført seg som han gjør i det norske samfunn. Hos oss er strukturen flat og vi finner oss ikke i å bli behandlet som kveg. Ofte uttaler Bates seg nedlatende, han behandler andre som brikker i sitt eget spill og er tydeligvis ikke involverende. Med interesse har jeg lest litt faglitteratur rundt emnet av sosiologer. Da har temaet gjerne vært trenerkultur. Hva er best? En trener ala Tom Nordlie eller en mer involverende type ala Arsene Wenger eller svenske trenere? Dette kan også overføres til ledere. Jeg har vel ikke lest endelige konklusjoner med to streker under svaret. Men i Norge fungerer det ikke i lengden med typer ala Tom Nordlie. I England kan det være anderledes. Der er de mer vant til en hierarktisk struktur.

Men jeg tror vi må ta innover oss at fotballklubber snart må ta ansvar for sin egen økonomi. I dette bildet mener jeg Bates tar ansvar. Men jeg har savnet en klart uttrykt ambisjon om satsning på egne talenter, slik mange andre klubber gjør. Hadde man sagt at vi ønsker å utvikle egne talenter, tror jeg man ville fått forståelse for dette. I dette ligger også at fansen roer seg og viser større tålmodighet.

Tålmodighet, ja. Bates er snart moden for gamlehjemmet. En ting er sikkert. De fleste her på forumet kommer til å overleve Ken Bates! Det er naturens gang.

[HåvardK]

En tredje ting er lederstil. Ken Bates kunne aldri ha oppført seg som han gjør i det norske samfunn. Hos oss er strukturen flat og vi finner oss ikke i å bli behandlet som kveg. Ofte uttaler Bates seg nedlatende, han behandler andre som brikker i sitt eget spill og er tydeligvis ikke involverende.

Bra og behersket innlegg, Masinga!

Syns vel ikke akkurat at du overdriver karakteristikken av Bates her ifht lederstilen. Og det er vel heller ikke bare i Norge at folk reagerer på lederstilen hans. Selv tror jeg at dette dessverre medfører at det har blitt vanskelig å knytte til seg god og nødvendig kompetanse for klubben; både på spiller - og trenersida. Det er nok ikke bare de "fornuftige" lønnsbetingelsene som gjør at mange velger å takke nei til Leeds.

[Tom S]

Leeds United exclusive:
Bates comes out fighting FULL INTERVIEW

By Phil Hay
Published on Friday 12 August 2011 17:11


Eighty years old in December and as full of fire as ever. The average octogenarian strolls down the slow lane with a walking stick and a pipe. Ken Bates won't be joining them soon.

"Still going strong," he says. "In fact, I intend to walk behind you at your funeral." How soon that event comes might depend on the content of this article.

As interviews go, there are easier discussions to stage. Leeds United's chairman arrives at Thorp Arch with a smile and a handshake but the questions in waiting are not typical of the first week of a new season. Negative would be one description; necessary another. This game of opinions so popular in Leeds has generated many in the dead months of summer.

We start at the top by discussing the squad at Elland Road, altered since May by the departure of five senior professionals and the arrival of four. There is a busy train of thought which says Leeds have invested less in their playing resources than they needed to, or less than they might have done. That particular complaint lands naturally on the desk of United's chairman and majority shareholder.

"Here's what we do," he says. "Every year we look at our income and work out our costs for 17 different departments. We also set aside a contingency for emergencies and such like. Then we give the rest to Simon (manager Simon Grayson) and say 'spend it on players'.

Budget

"If he wants to buy a player for £5m then that's up to him. But it might mean that he's only able to pay his other players three quid a week. So the budget is his and he invests the money as he sees fit. The decisions are his."

The obvious response is to ask whether that budget could have been bigger; whether Leeds are in a position to throw more money at their squad than they do at present. The club made £3m in profit during the last financial year and have made a seven-figure gain in three of the last four. Several teams in England are worried by bankruptcy but Leeds are not one of them or even close.

When Bates purchased a controlling stake in United in April of this year, he acquired one of the few clubs whose operations consistently make money. On that basis alone, it is to be expected that their expenditure will be scrutinised. Since he became chairman in January of 2005, that scrutiny has been fierce and consistent, coming most recently from the Houses of Parliament.

Parliament's concern is the ownership structure of Leeds in the aftermath of their insolvency in 2007. Locally, debate rages more intensely about the strength of the squad as it stands, three months and five days after United finished seventh in the Championship.

Bates concedes that "it might look as if we've not been very active" but he hotly disputes the suggestion that the club have set aside too little in transfer funds or enforced too low a wage bill to make something productive of this season.

"Our wage bill is one of the highest in the league," he says. "I'd estimate that it's in the upper levels of the top six and only lower than two or three clubs – West Ham for example.

"But I'm told that Leicester City, for all their billions, have imposed a wage cap, and their owners have said that they simply won't spend more than 'x'. FIFA are implementing rules on financial fair play and clubs are starting to realise that they have to live within their means. We already do that and it's how any successful club should operate. It's a proper financial system which is starting to catch on.

"At the moment we're spending as much (on players) as we can afford. If we spend any more and lose money then who covers that?

"Take Alan Smith – we spoke to Newcastle about doing a deal with him and were told that we'd have to pay £1m in wages over the next year. People say £1m isn't a lot of money but I say to them 'you put the money up then'."

I make the point that almost 11,000 fans have paid hundreds of pounds for season tickets and that last year's average attendance cleared 27,000 (Bates, true to form, knows the exact figure).

"But the income from season tickets only covers half the wage bill," he says. "That's the reality and it doesn't even touch the day-to-day costs of running the club.

"A lot of what we're doing is about the long term. I'll be dead by the time half of the kids in the academy come into the first team so it would be easy to say 'b***** the academy'. But many years down the line it's something that the club will benefit from, just as it's benefiting now. The squad's got a lot of home-grown players in it – Jonny Howson, Ben Parker and Aidan White. We had another debutant (17-year-old left-back Charlie Taylor) playing against Bradford in the Carling Cup on Tuesday night. So the investment is clearly paying off."

Bates expects the same to be true of the work carried out recently on Elland Road's East Stand, as yet to be completed. Council documents set the likely cost at £7m. In his midweek programme notes, Bates stated that the outlay on the East Stand would amount to £300,000. Either way, it has been a contentious talking point since work began to renew the structure in the first week of May.

The reconstruction to date is part of a more expansive plan of regeneration which, much like Bates' project at Chelsea, will in theory turn the East Stand into a commercial venture.

Income

Those who rail against United's owner have taken to signing 'build us a team, not a hotel', in reference to the stadium's future blueprint. They also make the point that Leeds are extensively developing a property they rent. Bates neither understands that argument nor accepts it. He claims that the facilities in the East Stand's upper tier were "some of the worst I've seen" when he became chairman six-and-a-half years ago.

"Here's the thing about the East Stand," he says. "The extra income it generates will more than pay back the money we've spent to do it. Then that income is always there. We'll also have a museum and facilities which I think the fans will appreciate.

"Believe it or not I want them to have a pleasurable experience when they come to games at Elland Road. It's why we've made so many changes to the ground. But it's important to have income streams that are safe or guaranteed, whatever happens on the pitch.

"We got a crowd of 38,000 for our FA Cup tie against Arsenal but a lot of those people were nowhere to be seen when we got 17,000 for a league game against Hereford. The average crowd last season was higher than that but the point I'm making is that you can't rely entirely on money which is dependent on last week's result."

Last week's result is nevertheless what matters to the average supporter, if marginally less than tomorrow's. United play Middlesbrough at Elland Road this weekend with the wounds of a heavy defeat at Southampton – their first league game of the Championship season – relatively fresh. Bates was criticised by the crowd at St Mary's and again on Tuesday during Leeds' Carling Cup first-round win over Bradford City. His treatment tomorrow on his first matchday appearance at Elland Road since the end of April remains to be seen. He does not look ruffled or unduly concerned, describing chants in his direction as "water off a duck's back".

"I've been listening to complaints for 50 years," Bates says. "When I took over at Chelsea I got a huge wad of letters attacking the previous bunch who'd been in charge.

"The secretary at the time said 'chairman, we get two types of complaints. When we're losing, the manager needs to be sacked. When we're winning, the tea tastes like p***'. But the chairman and the board of a club are there to be criticised; players and managers are there to be praised. It's always been that way.

Minority

"I also remember what Freddy Shepherd once said: directors are there to direct, managers and there to manage, players are there to play and supporters are there to support.

"I'm still here and the reason I'm here is because no Yorkshireman was willing to put his hand in his pocket in 2005 or 2007. If it wasn't for me, there wouldn't be a football club at all. The people complaining are a vociferous minority."

In answer to the matter of whether further signings are likely before the end of the transfer, Bates says yes. Among the club's targets, he explains, are Premier League players or "near Premier League players" – players, in effect, who Leeds intend to sign on loan.

"We can't afford to sign them outright, pure and simple, so you look to sign them on loan instead," he says. "That type of deal tends to happen towards the end of August when Premier League clubs pick their 25-man squads and know who's staying and who can go."

A fair riposte is to state that United's record in the loan market during Grayson's time as manager have been decidedly mixed. Deals to take Barry Bannan and Jake Livermore from Aston Villa and Tottenham Hotspur respectively did not appear to assist Leeds greatly in the final weeks of last season.

"I wouldn't disagree about them," says Bates, "but it's easy to be clever with hindsight and it doesn't mean that loans don't work. A lot of the more successful clubs in the Championship last season used them to get a better standard of player.

"It might have looked as if we've not been very active, but there's an awful lot going on which the supporters never see.

"We thought we'd signed Lee Bowyer, who would have been an excellent signing, but he's got two children and a long-term partner and he lives in the east end of London. So he joined Ipswich out of respect for his family. We spent a month working on a deal and that's the way it goes.

"But it's worth pointing out that the transfer window is still open and there are players out there who Simon is looking at. We haven't finished yet."

Which all leads round to the issue of most immediate importance: is the squad, as it stands or as Bates expects it to stand on September 1, capable of holding sixth place or better in the Championship? Moreover, is that the benchmark of United's board and a fair target for Grayson?

"I'd be disappointed if we didn't finish in the play-offs," Bates says. "There's no reason why we can't. I've got faith in the players and a lot of faith in the manager.

"I hear fans saying that the wage bill isn't big enough, or we don't spend much money, but how would they know how big our wage bill is or how much we spend?

"Take a look at Simon's record – in his first season, the play-offs. In his second, promotion. In his third, seventh place in the Championship. Does that look like a manager or a club whose budget isn't big enough?

"The way we run the club is for the good of the club, as time will tell. We're financially secure and upwardly mobile."

It's Bates' opinion and he's sticking to it.




http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/leeds_united_exclusive_bates_comes_out_fighting_full_interview_1_3675845

[ollan]

Leeds United exclusive:
Bates comes out fighting FULL INTERVIEW

By Phil Hay
Published on Friday 12 August 2011 17:11


Eighty years old in December and as full of fire as ever. The average octogenarian strolls down the slow lane with a walking stick and a pipe. Ken Bates won’t be joining them soon.

“Still going strong,” he says. “In fact, I intend to walk behind you at your funeral.” How soon that event comes might depend on the content of this article.

As interviews go, there are easier discussions to stage. Leeds United’s chairman arrives at Thorp Arch with a smile and a handshake but the questions in waiting are not typical of the first week of a new season. Negative would be one description; necessary another. This game of opinions so popular in Leeds has generated many in the dead months of summer.

We start at the top by discussing the squad at Elland Road, altered since May by the departure of five senior professionals and the arrival of four. There is a busy train of thought which says Leeds have invested less in their playing resources than they needed to, or less than they might have done. That particular complaint lands naturally on the desk of United’s chairman and majority shareholder.

“Here’s what we do,” he says. “Every year we look at our income and work out our costs for 17 different departments. We also set aside a contingency for emergencies and such like. Then we give the rest to Simon (manager Simon Grayson) and say ‘spend it on players’.

Budget

“If he wants to buy a player for £5m then that’s up to him. But it might mean that he’s only able to pay his other players three quid a week. So the budget is his and he invests the money as he sees fit. The decisions are his.”

The obvious response is to ask whether that budget could have been bigger; whether Leeds are in a position to throw more money at their squad than they do at present. The club made £3m in profit during the last financial year and have made a seven-figure gain in three of the last four. Several teams in England are worried by bankruptcy but Leeds are not one of them or even close.

When Bates purchased a controlling stake in United in April of this year, he acquired one of the few clubs whose operations consistently make money. On that basis alone, it is to be expected that their expenditure will be scrutinised. Since he became chairman in January of 2005, that scrutiny has been fierce and consistent, coming most recently from the Houses of Parliament.

Parliament’s concern is the ownership structure of Leeds in the aftermath of their insolvency in 2007. Locally, debate rages more intensely about the strength of the squad as it stands, three months and five days after United finished seventh in the Championship.

Bates concedes that “it might look as if we’ve not been very active” but he hotly disputes the suggestion that the club have set aside too little in transfer funds or enforced too low a wage bill to make something productive of this season.

“Our wage bill is one of the highest in the league,” he says. “I’d estimate that it’s in the upper levels of the top six and only lower than two or three clubs â€" West Ham for example.

“But I’m told that Leicester City, for all their billions, have imposed a wage cap, and their owners have said that they simply won’t spend more than ‘x’. FIFA are implementing rules on financial fair play and clubs are starting to realise that they have to live within their means. We already do that and it’s how any successful club should operate. It’s a proper financial system which is starting to catch on.

“At the moment we’re spending as much (on players) as we can afford. If we spend any more and lose money then who covers that?

“Take Alan Smith â€" we spoke to Newcastle about doing a deal with him and were told that we’d have to pay £1m in wages over the next year. People say £1m isn’t a lot of money but I say to them ‘you put the money up then’.”

I make the point that almost 11,000 fans have paid hundreds of pounds for season tickets and that last year’s average attendance cleared 27,000 (Bates, true to form, knows the exact figure).

“But the income from season tickets only covers half the wage bill,” he says. “That’s the reality and it doesn’t even touch the day-to-day costs of running the club.

“A lot of what we’re doing is about the long term. I’ll be dead by the time half of the kids in the academy come into the first team so it would be easy to say ‘b***** the academy’. But many years down the line it’s something that the club will benefit from, just as it’s benefiting now. The squad’s got a lot of home-grown players in it â€" Jonny Howson, Ben Parker and Aidan White. We had another debutant (17-year-old left-back Charlie Taylor) playing against Bradford in the Carling Cup on Tuesday night. So the investment is clearly paying off.”

Bates expects the same to be true of the work carried out recently on Elland Road’s East Stand, as yet to be completed. Council documents set the likely cost at £7m. In his midweek programme notes, Bates stated that the outlay on the East Stand would amount to £300,000. Either way, it has been a contentious talking point since work began to renew the structure in the first week of May.

The reconstruction to date is part of a more expansive plan of regeneration which, much like Bates’ project at Chelsea, will in theory turn the East Stand into a commercial venture.

Income

Those who rail against United’s owner have taken to signing ‘build us a team, not a hotel’, in reference to the stadium’s future blueprint. They also make the point that Leeds are extensively developing a property they rent. Bates neither understands that argument nor accepts it. He claims that the facilities in the East Stand’s upper tier were “some of the worst I’ve seen” when he became chairman six-and-a-half years ago.

“Here’s the thing about the East Stand,” he says. “The extra income it generates will more than pay back the money we’ve spent to do it. Then that income is always there. We’ll also have a museum and facilities which I think the fans will appreciate.

“Believe it or not I want them to have a pleasurable experience when they come to games at Elland Road. It’s why we’ve made so many changes to the ground. But it’s important to have income streams that are safe or guaranteed, whatever happens on the pitch.

“We got a crowd of 38,000 for our FA Cup tie against Arsenal but a lot of those people were nowhere to be seen when we got 17,000 for a league game against Hereford. The average crowd last season was higher than that but the point I’m making is that you can’t rely entirely on money which is dependent on last week’s result.”

Last week’s result is nevertheless what matters to the average supporter, if marginally less than tomorrow’s. United play Middlesbrough at Elland Road this weekend with the wounds of a heavy defeat at Southampton â€" their first league game of the Championship season â€" relatively fresh. Bates was criticised by the crowd at St Mary’s and again on Tuesday during Leeds’ Carling Cup first-round win over Bradford City. His treatment tomorrow on his first matchday appearance at Elland Road since the end of April remains to be seen. He does not look ruffled or unduly concerned, describing chants in his direction as “water off a duck’s back”.

“I’ve been listening to complaints for 50 years,” Bates says. “When I took over at Chelsea I got a huge wad of letters attacking the previous bunch who’d been in charge.

“The secretary at the time said ‘chairman, we get two types of complaints. When we’re losing, the manager needs to be sacked. When we’re winning, the tea tastes like p***’. But the chairman and the board of a club are there to be criticised; players and managers are there to be praised. It’s always been that way.

Minority

“I also remember what Freddy Shepherd once said: directors are there to direct, managers and there to manage, players are there to play and supporters are there to support.

“I’m still here and the reason I’m here is because no Yorkshireman was willing to put his hand in his pocket in 2005 or 2007. If it wasn’t for me, there wouldn’t be a football club at all. The people complaining are a vociferous minority.”

In answer to the matter of whether further signings are likely before the end of the transfer, Bates says yes. Among the club’s targets, he explains, are Premier League players or “near Premier League players” â€" players, in effect, who Leeds intend to sign on loan.

“We can’t afford to sign them outright, pure and simple, so you look to sign them on loan instead,” he says. “That type of deal tends to happen towards the end of August when Premier League clubs pick their 25-man squads and know who’s staying and who can go.”

A fair riposte is to state that United’s record in the loan market during Grayson’s time as manager have been decidedly mixed. Deals to take Barry Bannan and Jake Livermore from Aston Villa and Tottenham Hotspur respectively did not appear to assist Leeds greatly in the final weeks of last season.

“I wouldn’t disagree about them,” says Bates, “but it’s easy to be clever with hindsight and it doesn’t mean that loans don’t work. A lot of the more successful clubs in the Championship last season used them to get a better standard of player.

“It might have looked as if we’ve not been very active, but there’s an awful lot going on which the supporters never see.

“We thought we’d signed Lee Bowyer, who would have been an excellent signing, but he’s got two children and a long-term partner and he lives in the east end of London. So he joined Ipswich out of respect for his family. We spent a month working on a deal and that’s the way it goes.

“But it’s worth pointing out that the transfer window is still open and there are players out there who Simon is looking at. We haven’t finished yet.”

Which all leads round to the issue of most immediate importance: is the squad, as it stands or as Bates expects it to stand on September 1, capable of holding sixth place or better in the Championship? Moreover, is that the benchmark of United’s board and a fair target for Grayson?

“I’d be disappointed if we didn’t finish in the play-offs,” Bates says. “There’s no reason why we can’t. I’ve got faith in the players and a lot of faith in the manager.

“I hear fans saying that the wage bill isn’t big enough, or we don’t spend much money, but how would they know how big our wage bill is or how much we spend?

“Take a look at Simon’s record â€" in his first season, the play-offs. In his second, promotion. In his third, seventh place in the Championship. Does that look like a manager or a club whose budget isn’t big enough?

“The way we run the club is for the good of the club, as time will tell. We’re financially secure and upwardly mobile.”

It’s Bates’ opinion and he’s sticking to it.




http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/leeds_united_exclusive_bates_comes_out_fighting_full_interview_1_3675845

God britisk spissformulering :-) men som desverre for oss supportere betyr nada.......bbbbates out,men vil noen inn?

ollan

[sportcarl1]

Leeds United exclusive:
Bates comes out fighting FULL INTERVIEW

By Phil Hay
Published on Friday 12 August 2011 17:11


Eighty years old in December and as full of fire as ever. The average octogenarian strolls down the slow lane with a walking stick and a pipe. Ken Bates won’t be joining them soon.

“Still going strong,” he says. “In fact, I intend to walk behind you at your funeral.” How soon that event comes might depend on the content of this article.

As interviews go, there are easier discussions to stage. Leeds United’s chairman arrives at Thorp Arch with a smile and a handshake but the questions in waiting are not typical of the first week of a new season. Negative would be one description; necessary another. This game of opinions so popular in Leeds has generated many in the dead months of summer.

We start at the top by discussing the squad at Elland Road, altered since May by the departure of five senior professionals and the arrival of four. There is a busy train of thought which says Leeds have invested less in their playing resources than they needed to, or less than they might have done. That particular complaint lands naturally on the desk of United’s chairman and majority shareholder.

“Here’s what we do,” he says. “Every year we look at our income and work out our costs for 17 different departments. We also set aside a contingency for emergencies and such like. Then we give the rest to Simon (manager Simon Grayson) and say ‘spend it on players’.

Budget

“If he wants to buy a player for £5m then that’s up to him. But it might mean that he’s only able to pay his other players three quid a week. So the budget is his and he invests the money as he sees fit. The decisions are his.”

The obvious response is to ask whether that budget could have been bigger; whether Leeds are in a position to throw more money at their squad than they do at present. The club made £3m in profit during the last financial year and have made a seven-figure gain in three of the last four. Several teams in England are worried by bankruptcy but Leeds are not one of them or even close.

When Bates purchased a controlling stake in United in April of this year, he acquired one of the few clubs whose operations consistently make money. On that basis alone, it is to be expected that their expenditure will be scrutinised. Since he became chairman in January of 2005, that scrutiny has been fierce and consistent, coming most recently from the Houses of Parliament.

Parliament’s concern is the ownership structure of Leeds in the aftermath of their insolvency in 2007. Locally, debate rages more intensely about the strength of the squad as it stands, three months and five days after United finished seventh in the Championship.

Bates concedes that “it might look as if we’ve not been very active” but he hotly disputes the suggestion that the club have set aside too little in transfer funds or enforced too low a wage bill to make something productive of this season.

“Our wage bill is one of the highest in the league,” he says. “I’d estimate that it’s in the upper levels of the top six and only lower than two or three clubs â€" West Ham for example.

“But I’m told that Leicester City, for all their billions, have imposed a wage cap, and their owners have said that they simply won’t spend more than ‘x’. FIFA are implementing rules on financial fair play and clubs are starting to realise that they have to live within their means. We already do that and it’s how any successful club should operate. It’s a proper financial system which is starting to catch on.

“At the moment we’re spending as much (on players) as we can afford. If we spend any more and lose money then who covers that?

“Take Alan Smith â€" we spoke to Newcastle about doing a deal with him and were told that we’d have to pay £1m in wages over the next year. People say £1m isn’t a lot of money but I say to them ‘you put the money up then’.”

I make the point that almost 11,000 fans have paid hundreds of pounds for season tickets and that last year’s average attendance cleared 27,000 (Bates, true to form, knows the exact figure).

“But the income from season tickets only covers half the wage bill,” he says. “That’s the reality and it doesn’t even touch the day-to-day costs of running the club.

“A lot of what we’re doing is about the long term. I’ll be dead by the time half of the kids in the academy come into the first team so it would be easy to say ‘b***** the academy’. But many years down the line it’s something that the club will benefit from, just as it’s benefiting now. The squad’s got a lot of home-grown players in it â€" Jonny Howson, Ben Parker and Aidan White. We had another debutant (17-year-old left-back Charlie Taylor) playing against Bradford in the Carling Cup on Tuesday night. So the investment is clearly paying off.”

Bates expects the same to be true of the work carried out recently on Elland Road’s East Stand, as yet to be completed. Council documents set the likely cost at £7m. In his midweek programme notes, Bates stated that the outlay on the East Stand would amount to £300,000. Either way, it has been a contentious talking point since work began to renew the structure in the first week of May.

The reconstruction to date is part of a more expansive plan of regeneration which, much like Bates’ project at Chelsea, will in theory turn the East Stand into a commercial venture.

Income

Those who rail against United’s owner have taken to signing ‘build us a team, not a hotel’, in reference to the stadium’s future blueprint. They also make the point that Leeds are extensively developing a property they rent. Bates neither understands that argument nor accepts it. He claims that the facilities in the East Stand’s upper tier were “some of the worst I’ve seen” when he became chairman six-and-a-half years ago.

“Here’s the thing about the East Stand,” he says. “The extra income it generates will more than pay back the money we’ve spent to do it. Then that income is always there. We’ll also have a museum and facilities which I think the fans will appreciate.

“Believe it or not I want them to have a pleasurable experience when they come to games at Elland Road. It’s why we’ve made so many changes to the ground. But it’s important to have income streams that are safe or guaranteed, whatever happens on the pitch.

“We got a crowd of 38,000 for our FA Cup tie against Arsenal but a lot of those people were nowhere to be seen when we got 17,000 for a league game against Hereford. The average crowd last season was higher than that but the point I’m making is that you can’t rely entirely on money which is dependent on last week’s result.”

Last week’s result is nevertheless what matters to the average supporter, if marginally less than tomorrow’s. United play Middlesbrough at Elland Road this weekend with the wounds of a heavy defeat at Southampton â€" their first league game of the Championship season â€" relatively fresh. Bates was criticised by the crowd at St Mary’s and again on Tuesday during Leeds’ Carling Cup first-round win over Bradford City. His treatment tomorrow on his first matchday appearance at Elland Road since the end of April remains to be seen. He does not look ruffled or unduly concerned, describing chants in his direction as “water off a duck’s back”.

“I’ve been listening to complaints for 50 years,” Bates says. “When I took over at Chelsea I got a huge wad of letters attacking the previous bunch who’d been in charge.

“The secretary at the time said ‘chairman, we get two types of complaints. When we’re losing, the manager needs to be sacked. When we’re winning, the tea tastes like p***’. But the chairman and the board of a club are there to be criticised; players and managers are there to be praised. It’s always been that way.

Minority

“I also remember what Freddy Shepherd once said: directors are there to direct, managers and there to manage, players are there to play and supporters are there to support.

“I’m still here and the reason I’m here is because no Yorkshireman was willing to put his hand in his pocket in 2005 or 2007. If it wasn’t for me, there wouldn’t be a football club at all. The people complaining are a vociferous minority.”

In answer to the matter of whether further signings are likely before the end of the transfer, Bates says yes. Among the club’s targets, he explains, are Premier League players or “near Premier League players” â€" players, in effect, who Leeds intend to sign on loan.

“We can’t afford to sign them outright, pure and simple, so you look to sign them on loan instead,” he says. “That type of deal tends to happen towards the end of August when Premier League clubs pick their 25-man squads and know who’s staying and who can go.”

A fair riposte is to state that United’s record in the loan market during Grayson’s time as manager have been decidedly mixed. Deals to take Barry Bannan and Jake Livermore from Aston Villa and Tottenham Hotspur respectively did not appear to assist Leeds greatly in the final weeks of last season.

“I wouldn’t disagree about them,” says Bates, “but it’s easy to be clever with hindsight and it doesn’t mean that loans don’t work. A lot of the more successful clubs in the Championship last season used them to get a better standard of player.

“It might have looked as if we’ve not been very active, but there’s an awful lot going on which the supporters never see.

“We thought we’d signed Lee Bowyer, who would have been an excellent signing, but he’s got two children and a long-term partner and he lives in the east end of London. So he joined Ipswich out of respect for his family. We spent a month working on a deal and that’s the way it goes.

“But it’s worth pointing out that the transfer window is still open and there are players out there who Simon is looking at. We haven’t finished yet.”

Which all leads round to the issue of most immediate importance: is the squad, as it stands or as Bates expects it to stand on September 1, capable of holding sixth place or better in the Championship? Moreover, is that the benchmark of United’s board and a fair target for Grayson?

“I’d be disappointed if we didn’t finish in the play-offs,” Bates says. “There’s no reason why we can’t. I’ve got faith in the players and a lot of faith in the manager.

“I hear fans saying that the wage bill isn’t big enough, or we don’t spend much money, but how would they know how big our wage bill is or how much we spend?

“Take a look at Simon’s record â€" in his first season, the play-offs. In his second, promotion. In his third, seventh place in the Championship. Does that look like a manager or a club whose budget isn’t big enough?

“The way we run the club is for the good of the club, as time will tell. We’re financially secure and upwardly mobile.”

It’s Bates’ opinion and he’s sticking to it.




http://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/sport/leeds-united/latest-whites-news/leeds_united_exclusive_bates_comes_out_fighting_full_interview_1_3675845

äntligen en bates intervjuv som viss i sin helhet och inte är limmade och klippta på andra(leedsfanssidor)

[Leedsfan]

Hva sier dere, snakker Bates sant?

[h.b]

Hva sier dere, snakker Bates sant?

Tja sier vel det som passer ham bra. Hadde aldri forventa at han ville sagt  at vi har råd. Men jeg vil ikke satse.

[Budda]

Hva sier dere, snakker Bates sant?

Jeg er ingen utpreget motstander av Bates, men jeg har sluttet å høre/tru på hva Bates sier etter alle de idiotiske utsagnene i media og kampprogram. Bates tar skjelden selvkritikk og skal alltid legge skylden på andre. Dette har medført at jeg tar alle utsagn fra Bates med en klype salt.

[newsome]

Trist å lese Bates intervjuet!

Vi blir stående på stedet hvil så lenge han styrer.
Og det blir nok dessverre lenge.

[lojosang]

Tenk om vi hadde gjort det under Krasner.

-LeifO

Moderatortroll.

[SDalen]

Stygt å si det, men gleder meg til han blir borte... Leeds har ambisjoner om å komme (akkurat som de skulle) tilbake i det gode sirkuset. Men som dagens fotball har blitt er man nødt til å satse, for å nå mål dvs bruke penger! At bates ikke ser det selv, hva sparer han på pengene for? Han er gammel, rik og hobbyen hans er å vimse rundt i Monaco! Han kunne liksågodt satsa litt på spillerkjøp, for å kanskje, mest sannsynlig gjøre formuen enda større! Dette er han dessverre nødt å innse selv, og der virker som ingen kan fortelle han det, han er nødt for å lære det selv... Trist men sant, BATES OUT!

[SDalen]

Merkeligst av alt, virker det nesten som han legger ansvaret på Grayson for pengebruken.. Lukter det en dårlig tone dem imellom? Har hørt rykter om det.. Isåfall ikke bra

[Leedsfan]

Merkeligst av alt, virker det nesten som han legger ansvaret på Grayson for pengebruken.. Lukter det en dårlig tone dem imellom? Har hørt rykter om det.. Isåfall ikke bra

Han sier jo at han har gitt Grayson et budsjett som omhandler en totalkostnad. Hvis ikke dette stemmer så hadde jo Grayson klikka...

[HåvardK]

Hva sier dere, snakker Bates sant?

Jeg er ingen utpreget motstander av Bates, men jeg har sluttet å høre/tru på hva Bates sier etter alle de idiotiske utsagnene i media og kampprogram. Bates tar skjelden selvkritikk og skal alltid legge skylden på andre. Dette har medført at jeg tar alle utsagn fra Bates med en klype salt.

Feil ordbruk. Foreslår at du endrer det til aldri.